Negotiation part II: How to Set Your Rates

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Last time, we discussed the pitfalls we encounter negotiating with clients. We also need to talk about how to quote “standard” rates for what you do. While I wish I could just put up a chart, this is a complex subject, and varies with location, experience and market. There are some things we can do to get this under control, however.

Know Your Market

Find out what others are charging for a type of service. This may require some research and questions of people working in your area. For example, if you have a wedding band:

  • What is the range of prices for receptions in your area?
  • What do the agents charge and what percentage do they mark up the band?
  • How long are the gigs, and how is overtime handled?

if you are a freelance musician:

  • What is the typical pay range for the type of gig you are doing? (restaurants, weddings, corporate, tours etc)
  • Are there surcharges for travel, excessive cartage etc.?

If you are doing recording sessions:

  • Do you get paid by the hour, day rate, or by the song?
  • What are the typical hourly, daily, and per song rates?
  • Rates are typically different for demo, indie release, label, and corporate sessions.
Don’t Underbid (!)

One of the biggest mistakes musicians make is to charge a low “introductory” rate to get into the scene. While this might seem logical, the results can be unpleasant:

  • Your low rate will drive everybody’s price down artificially low. Now everybody is making less because of you. It will be hard to get the support of your fellow musicians under these conditions.
  • You will have a hard time getting your price up to a reasonable level, since you established the low number. Better to start at the professional rate.
  • Higher paying work will go to somebody else, because you will have labeled yourself as the “bargain.” When people hit the lottery jackpot, they don’t go out and buy a Kia.
  • You may think that if you are young and inexperienced, you should charge less than the veterans. Instead, let them set the “premium” rates if they can get them.

Be Prepared

A dangerous moment: somebody asks you, “What do you charge for X” and you don’t have a number ready. What will happen is that you will stumble around as you try to calculate your bid, which looks unprofessional, and you will inevitably come up with a low number, based on panic. Instead, have your standard rates ready for all the things you do.

  • I have rates for lessons, solo piano, band gigs, sessions of various types, mixing, mastering, arranging etc.
  • I am aware of the factors that can change the rates: travel, cartage, rehearsals, technical issues, excessive hours etc.
  • I ask questions before bidding: Hours, conditions, equipment, other musicians, location, attire etc.
  • I have formulas for groups: X$ per man per hour, plus leader fee. This way I can calculate quickly based on the size of the group and the hours.
  • I have a good idea of how long it will take me to do certain tasks such as mixing, based on the complexity of the music. This way I can estimate the hours needed and provide a quote.

The Song that Never Ends…

One issue that comes up is the decision whether to work by the hour or by the piece.

  • Generally, if the end time is controlled by the client, such as vocal recording or band tracking, I recommend charging by the hour, since a package price could become very low if the project drags on. This also gives the client an incentive to move things along.
  • If, however, you are working on your own, I suggest charging by the finished piece or by the finished minute. This is more typical for mastering and composition. The reason for this is that as you become more efficient, you will end up making less for the same job.
  • Doing session work by the song can occasionally be troublesome if you are working with people who don’t know what they want; you may end up spending a long time helping them find it. By the time you are done, your hourly rate is woefully low.
The Negotiator

Some gigs, such as custom composing, are harder to bid based on the vagueness of the concept. Often I have a number in my mind of how much it is worth to me, based on an internal hourly rate I use. If I am approached about a project, I will guess at how long it will take, and that will give me a general idea of a full price. I also have a number below this for the least I will possibly take.

However, I won’t reveal that quote right away. Instead I will ask them “What is your budget for the music?” and see if I can get them to give me a number. This allows me to know how serious they are. If they don’t even know where to begin, I will give them the full price, and see how they react. If they have “sticker shock,” it may be that I am too pricey for them. If they truly can’t make that price, I will move towards my minimum. At this point, it is a good idea to watch for the dirty negotiation tricks we talked about last time.

  • Have a way of calculating your “standard” price for a negotiable gig.
  • Know what questions to ask so you understand the parameters, and you won’t get a surprise.
  • Ask them for a number first.
  • NEVER drop below your minimum price; you will resent the gig, and lower everybody’s rates.
  • It is OK to not take a gig if it is below your rates. This is your prerogative as a professional.

Questions:

Do you have standard rates ready for everything you do?

Do you know what the range of rates people charge in your area?
In another article, we will discuss the “Gig Stealers” and how to deal with them…

©2012 Randy Hoexter


Comments

12 responses to “Negotiation part II: How to Set Your Rates”

  1. […] time, we will discuss setting your “standard” rates, and how to work within a dynamic pricing […]

  2. There IS this very helpful advice about freelance pricing…

    http://dashes.com/anil/2005/05/pay-by-the-hour.html

    1. randyhoexter Avatar
      randyhoexter

      Can’t argue with that logic.

  3. Steven Charles Avatar
    Steven Charles

    In my questions, of course I try to ask “what is your budget”, which often isn’t answered, or by “we’re just getting quotes & availability on some bands”. This is the hardest & most uncomfortable part of this business, for me, as often I must “fly blind”, for as much as I try to get a sense of whether the voice on the line is a small business, big company or corporation, wealthy person, not-wealthy person, etc, it’s sometimes just not happening.

    Also, the “market rates” are not so easy to determine as well, unless other bandleaders are comfortable sharing that info., and most agents are not. I have thought of having a friend call various agencies & bands, to get an idea, and probably should do so. Plus, just as I was getting into a nice flow, the economy tanked, and threw everything into a tizzy. I found some bids, that I considered very low, were obviously not low enough, yet there were some clients who were quite willing to pay a more “market price”, but figuring out who is who, is the hard part….

    1. randyhoexter Avatar
      randyhoexter

      I agree… sometimes it takes some “espionage.” And it is an ever-changing target. Still, I think we can get a general feel for what people are charging and stay competitive.

  4. PJ Eichner Avatar
    PJ Eichner

    Hey Randy. I used to be one of your students at AIM. You were a great teacher when it came to music, but you also gave us a ton of insight in to what to expect in the real world of music. It is something that has helped me a ton in my own career and I’m glad you are doing these posts because I’m still learning from you. Keep it up and thank you for you insight.

    1. randyhoexter Avatar
      randyhoexter

      Thanks PJ! Glad to hear these are helpful.

  5. […] can use negotiation tricks to put you at a disadvantage, and how you need to prepare yourself with rates and prices, but we also need to discuss how your fellow musician can undermine the […]

  6. Geoff Avatar
    Geoff

    What about publishing standard fees on your website? Good idea or not?

    1. randyhoexter Avatar
      randyhoexter

      I feel that they vary too much by region, type of gig, experience level and conditions to be accurately quoted… I know it sounds like a cop-out. Asking around in your area is still probably the best way to get an idea what is the going rate. Good luck!

      1. Geoff Avatar
        Geoff

        Hi Randy – thanks for the reply! Actually, I’m wondering what you think about musicians putting their fees on their websites. I have a page on my site with some standard rates (with disclaimers about every event being different and how each job will be priced out individually) and wonder if that’s a bad idea, i.e., does it put me at a competivive disadvantage, or is it good business practice to be up front for prospective clients?

        1. randyhoexter Avatar
          randyhoexter

          Hey Geoff, I don’t see a problem with publishing your rates, if you feel comfortable with them. It doesn’t bother me to lose a client who is only price-shopping; they may go elsewhere to save a few bucks, but I say good riddance… cheapskates are usually the most high-maintenance customers.

          As far as competition, there are always underbidders ( I wrote another blog about this: “How they Steal Your Gig”) But I prefer to take the “high road” and be consistent and clear about my rates….

          Thanks for reading!

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